** Soul Sleep **
Soul Sleep: Good scriptural arguments both for and against! (I'm really confused LOL)
* * Note: This page has been updated as of Tuesday, 20 June 2006 with new material after the initial conclusion; I may have been somewhat wrong! Plus, as of Saturday, 06 February 2010, I am updating the links section & adding the passage on dry bones. --As of Tuesday, 08 March 2011, I'm adding another scripture section dealing with being "absent from the body but be present with the Lord" - and offering a rebuttal to the excellent points made by Rev. Buddy L. Cocherell regarding Rev. 6:9-11 not being literal. MONDAY, 09 July 2012, citations to Daniel 12:2 and 12:13 were added.--Editor, Gordon Wayne Watts--

In “soul sleep” (a doctrine believed by the Jehovah’s Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, and Christadelphianism), the person is “asleep” and not conscious after he or she dies and awaits the resurrection.

Proponents of this doctrine cite such Old Testament passages as are shown on page 169 of the JW literature, Reasoning from the Scriptures:

* Eccl. 9:5,10 (dead don’t know anything)

* Ps. 146:4 (when his spirit goes back to the ground, his thoughts perish)

* Ezek. 18:4 (The soul that sins shall surely die)

* Even Acts 13:36 (a NT scripture not mentioned in this JW passage) mentions King David as asleep, to describe him being dead. This may merely apply to David’s body being asleep -or, it may show that Soul Sleep is what really happens when we die, so it too is an inconclusive passage.

* Lastly, one might also cite Rev. 20:5 to claim that “the rest of the dead lived not again” until the 1,000 years had passed and then were resurrected. However, this too does not address whether it was merely a bodily resurrection or resurrection of “sleeping souls” as well.

Taken at fact value -and without the benefit of “comparing scripture with scripture” to see the original meaning in its proper context, it might be reasonable to assume that when one dies, he or she is merely “asleep.” However, two facts are often neglected, which allow for the figurative and metaphoric parable to be taken literally:

(1) In the Old Testament, many truths were not fully understood but later revealed in the New Testament. (In fact, even today, we “see through the glass darkly” I Corinthians 13:12; How much more then?)

(2) King Solomon was speaking metaphorically, not literally.

Let’s take a look at point 2 first, since it admittedly the weaker of the two arguments: Solomon’s father, David also spoke this way: “Let the sea roar...Let the floods clap their hands: let the hills be joyful…” (Psalm 98:7-8, KJV) So, does the sea really “roar?” ~ Do floods have hands to clap? ~ Can hills express emotions? NO! This is metaphorical speaking -poetry, if you will, not literal. Likewise with the following: “3 The sea saw it, and fled: Jordan was driven back. 4 The mountains skipped like rams, and the little hills like lambs.” (Psalm 114:3-4, KJV) Cf: Job 38:7, KJV, which states: “When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?” Can the sea really see it and flee? Do mountains skip and dance around? Can the stars really sing? Scientists might describe a star as “singing” when it transmits light, like a singer transmits sound -and we can sometimes describe hills as “skipping” is under the influence of a major earthquake, but much of this is metaphorical poetry, nothing more. However, what about the strong claims of DAVID and JEREMIAH, accusing God of very evil?!

* Jeremiah (the “weeping prophet”) in Lam. 3:1-18 says that he has lost all hope in the Lord (v.18), who has shut out his prayer (v.8). Did the Lord really let him down? Did he really refuse to hear his prayer?

* David (in a state of depression and often on the run for his life) says in Ps. 13:1-4 that God has forgotten him and has hidden His face from him. Oh, really? Is the literally true? No, this too is metaphorical: What David and Jeremiah allege and claim would be against the nature of God: See e.g., verses 5 & 6: David’s heart shall rejoice in God’s salvation, and the Psalmist will sing to the Lord because He has dealt bountifully with him. But does this mean that the soul sleep scriptures above in Ecclesiastes are wrong per se? Taken by itself, no: All it really means is that these scriptures could be or might be metaphorical poetry -and not literal -but many other scriptures, in the New Testament (point 1) which are definitely not metaphorical, paint a different picture and show truths not fully revealed in Old Testament times:

First, here are scriptures that many try to use to disprove Soul Sleep, but they are not conclusive:

* Some cite Matt. 10:28 and Luke 12:4, which say that only God can kill the soul, but this does not address whether or not the soul is “asleep” after bodily death. Ditto with Acts 7:59: When Stephen saw the heavens open (right before getting stoned) and asked the Lord Jesus to receive his spirit, he did not say that he would remain “awake.”

* To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord: II Cor. 5:6-8 and Phil. 1:23. However, one may be “asleep in the Lord,” so this scripture alone does not disprove Soul Sleep.

* Paul was caught up in paradise, not merely asleep: II Cor. 12:2-4, but maybe he was not dead here. (Perhaps, it was merely an out-of-body or “near death” experience.)

* “And Jesus said unto him [the thief on the cross], Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.” Luke 23:43. However, some have suggested that this scripture means that Jesus was saying “Today, I say to you…” to mean that the time He was speaking was “today.” This doesn’t make sense, for why would Jesus say “Today is the day I’m speaking to you?” However, it is possible, so this scripture doesn’t disprove Soul Sleep all by itself. Also, even if it is true, the thief may be in paradise, but merely “asleep in the spirit.” So, again, this scripture is inconclusive to disprove Soul Sleep.

* Luke 16:22-23 tells of the a beggar named Lazarus and a rich man visiting Abraham’s bosom in Hades. However, many have suggested this is a parable, so it too is inconclusive proof.

* A little more convincing is I Peter 3:19-20 and 4:6, where Jesus preached unto the very dead, possibly those who had perished in Noah’s flood, but this too may be metaphorical to those who are merely “spiritually dead.” Thus, it too is inconclusive.

* Matt. 27:52 clearly says that “the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose.” It doesn’t say that the “sleeping souls” arose, just the bodies. Yet, admittedly, it also doesn’t deny that “sleeping souls” arose -it is silent on the subject, and unfortunately inconclusive.

* Still better are Matthew 17:1-8 and Mark 9:2-10, which show Moses and Elijah in the transfiguration on the mount. Clearly, here they were not merely “asleep,” but one criticism that might be leveled against this scripture is the claim that Jesus did a special miracle here and “awoke” them from sleep. Hence, again, this is not conclusive proof against “Soul Sleep.” (Along these lines is Luke 24:36-40, which shows Jesus awake, not asleep, after death, but this too may be described as an exception or a miracle, and not the norm.)

Call in the “A” Team: Here are scriptures which definitively disprove Soul Sleep:

* Rev. 6:9-11 tells of martyrs under the altar in heaven crying out to God asking Him how long He will wait to avenge their blood. Clearly these people are souls without bodies, but they aren’t asleep. This is not taken as a parable, and yet, this occurs before the resurrection. Hmm… Soul Sleep: Bite the dust: You are false. Since man is made in the image of God, who is a spirit without a body, this now makes more sense: Indeed, we think of the “normal” state to be soul and spirit in body, but this in fact is probably the exception, a temporary existence whilst we are here on earth in temporal existence. In Rev. 20:4, John saw the souls of the beheaded martyrs, not bodies, who “lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.” Clearly souls that are “asleep” don’t do this! In Rev. 20:9, we again find the saints, apparently in heaven and also before the Rapture, 2nd coming -obviously, from the context (verse 10, where the devil is still fighting!), before their resurrection & final judgment, so, they are clearly “dead” people, but yet not in “soul sleep.”

UPDATE: It has been suggested by B. L. Cocherell in his article, What happens at the moment of DEATH? that Rev. 6:9-11 is not literal, and in his defense, he offers 4 passages. Let's take a look at them in the KJV of the Holy Bible:

Genesis 4:10 (Comment: Abel's blood cries out.)
10 - And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.

Habakkuk 2:11 (Comment: The stone cries out, & the timber answers it.)
11 - For the stone shall cry out of the wall, and the beam out of the timber shall answer it.

James 5:4 (Comment: The hire, e.g., the wages cry out, & also those who have reaped cry out.)
4 - Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud, crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth.

Hebrews 11:4 (Comment: The dead Abel cried out.)
4 - By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Now, these scriptures seem to make Rev. 6:9-11 appear to be a parable, and thus not literal, but let's look again at that passage, this time, from the Amplified Bible, Copyright © 1954, 1958, 1962, 1964, 1965, 1987 by The Lockman Foundation, and used in part under 'Fair Use':

Revelation 6:9-11 (Holy Bible, AMP)
9 - When the Lamb broke open the fifth seal, I saw at the foot of the altar the souls of those whose lives had been sacrificed for [adhering to] the Word of God and for the testimony they had borne.
10 - They cried in a loud voice, O [Sovereign] Lord, holy and true, how long now before You will sit in judgment and avenge our blood upon those who dwell on the earth?
11 - Then they were each given a long and flowing and festive white robe and told to rest and wait patiently a little while longer, until the number should be complete of their fellow servants and their brethren who were to be killed as they themselves had been.

Do you see the difference? In all 4 of the passages that Bro. Buddy Cocherell cites above, the cries are intransitive verbs -without any direct objects of their action! That is, they simply "cry out" in general -but not with any message that would imply or mandate an intelligence behind it, and thus no intelligence is required. The "cry" here is akin to a star "crying out" by emitting light, or a thunder storm "crying out" with the sound of thunder. Indeed, in all 4 passages Buddy cites, no such message is "cried out." HOWEVER, notice the TRANSITIVE verb in Rev. 6:9-11, where the souls beneath the alter cry out with a specific "direct object," that is: a specific message. Namely, they are asking The Almighty: "O [Sovereign] Lord, holy and true, how long now before You will sit in judgment and avenge our blood..." -- Notice, also the reply by The Lord God:

They were each given a long and flowing and festive white robe -and told to wait a little while longer!

Does this seem like someone in "soul sleep?" -- NOT!

Indeed, this is like Luke 18:7, which says: "And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them?"

ALSO: In Jude 1:7, for example, we find that the souls of the dead sinners of Sodom and Gomorrha are “suffering” eternal vengeance of God. Souls that are asleep do not “suffer” pain and the like. PS: In Gen. 35:18, Rachel’s soul didn’t “fall asleep”; It “departed.”

Thus, we can rest assured that Paul was not describing mere soul sleep in Phil. 1:23, when he said that he was torn between life on earth on being with Christ -and his depiction of the heavenly body in II Cor. 5:1: “For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens,” not merely a soul that is asleep. Matt. 22:32 shows God is the God of the living, not the dead, and according to other scriptures here, the “awake,” not the “asleep.”


New: Section Added Tue. 08 Mar. 2011
On being absent from the body & Present with the Lord

We see more 'A-Team' scriptures to refute Soul Sleep. Observe:

2nd Corinthians 5:8 (Holy Bible, KJV) says: "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord."

While I admit it doesn't explicitly say the person is conscious & 'soul awake,' this is implied, but there's more:

In John 12:26, Jesus said: "...where I am, there shall also my servant be..." which indicated the saved ARE present with the SAVIOUR -period. Still, not conclusive, but check this out:

Let's look at Philippians 1:21-24 in the New King James Version (Copyright © 1982 by Thomas Nelson, Inc., selected portions used under Fair Use)

21 For to me, to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
22 But if I live on in the flesh, this will mean fruit from my labor; yet what I shall choose I cannot tell.
23 For[a] I am hard-pressed between the two, having a desire to depart and be with Christ, which is far better.
24 Nevertheless to remain in the flesh is more needful for you.

Footnotes:
a.Philippians 1:23 NU-Text and M-Text read But.

Compare this with 2nd Timothy 4:6 (in the KJV), where Paul writes this: "For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand."

If Paul were going to be in a state of non-being or non-existence as some Soul Sleep proponents say, it would not be a departure, but rather a ceasing to exist. Right? Also, why would it be "far better" in Phil. 1:21-24 above if Paul were going to be asleep and/or nonexistent!? Eh?

So, this, while not conclusive, offers STRONG support for the "not asleep" proposition. This ends the most recent update, except I would say one thing else:

Since you will find that this Theological Position Paper here makes a compelling case for BOTH 'Soul Sleep' AND the lack of it (e.g., being consciously aware & AWAKE after death), I would ask that you re-read my entire paper, and pay especially close attention to those verses that DISAGREE with your view. -- By that, I mean, if you believe in Soul Sleep, look at the verses that suggest the dead ARE aware, and if you one of those who believe 'Soul Sleep' is "bad theology," then please look VERY CLOSELY at the verses herein that suggest that there really *is* 'Soul Sleep.'

Otherwise, you will be missing an opportunity to learn and grow --and be a lazy slacker! -- So, please heed my request & advice here so you can be like the Bereans who were: "more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." (Acts 17:11, Holy Bible, KJV; C.f.: vv.10-13)


WHOOPS! “RED ALERT”: The “A” Team just ran into some problems: Here they are

FIRST: Let’s look again at Revelation 6:9-11 (King James Version)

9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Analysis: These are the martyred saints under the alter, from the above discussion, remember? But here’s something I didn’t notice at first: While the “Soul Sleep” doctrine is soundly refuted by Rev. 6:9-10, where the souls of the departed were clearly awake, not asleep (as in “Soul Sleep”), nonetheless, we see in verse 11 “that they should rest yet for a little season,” which kind of looks like Soul Sleep. (Do you think?)

NEXT: Let’s look again at Revelation 20:4 (quoting verses 4 and 5 below in the KJV)

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Analysis: These are the same martyred saints from above, OK? Verse 4 seems to support the fact that “Soul Sleep” is not happening here at this time, but now notice verse 5, in which we are told that “the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.” This also kind of looks like “Soul Sleep,” which is contrasted with the “Soul Awake” condition of the martyred saints before they too had to “they should rest yet for a little season” more.

FURTHERMORE: Daniel 12:2 and 12:13 suggest 'Soul Sleep' rest:

DANIEL 12 (KJV)
2 - And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
13 - But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

Conclusion: While we see conclusive proof for the lack of Soul Sleep these verses, and in support of the claim that Jude 1:7 is speaking of souls who aren’t asleep or destroyed, we also see evidence that there are souls who are asleep, either described as resting or as not living, in either case, a form of bring “asleep.” So, in my opinion, it appears that both soul sleep *and* the lack of it are present at different times. Hmm… I’m sure both sides will be displeased with this conclusion, but this is what I find. -=-Editor, Gordon Watts

Ezekiel 37:1-14 (HOLY BIBLE, King James Version)
1 The hand of the LORD was upon me, and carried me out in the spirit of the LORD, and set me down in the midst of the valley which was full of bones,
2 And caused me to pass by them round about: and, behold, there were very many in the open valley; and, lo, they were very dry.

Comments / Analysis: Key phrase: "VERY DRY" - I'll translate that for you: 'Looks like SOUL SLEEP!!' - OK, now continuing...

3 And he said unto me, Son of man, can these bones live? And I answered, O Lord GOD, thou knowest.
4 Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD.
5 Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
7 So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone.
8 And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them.

Comments / Analysis: OK, now we have bodies without breath (spirit) -which *may* OR MAY NOT have souls in them -the scripture does not say -it only addresses the spirit and body aspects -look more closely if you missed it. - OK, now continuing...

9 Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live.
10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.

Comments / Analysis: So, now we have bodies which have spirits, the breath of life, in them. TRANSLATION: "Not" Soul Sleep -but rather very awake!! Are we confused yet? I am - and with very good reason: There are good arguments the 'Soul Sleep' DOES happen SOME of the time.)

11 Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

Comments / Analysis: OK, concluding here, we see that this may just be a parable (look at the verses 11-14 here), but then again ... it does not say: It MAY BE a literal vision of the future. (Lastly, even IF the bodies were dead, the souls of those persons may have been awake and conscious -it simply does not say here.)

Conclusion: Remember my 'conclusion' above? We saw conclusive proof for both soul sleep AND THE LACK OF soul sleep ... Therefore, in conclusion, in my humble opinion, it appears that both soul sleep *and* the lack of it are present at different times. Hmm… I’m sure both sides will be displeased with this conclusion, but I am not afraid to admit where I am uncertain -and this is indeed what I find. So, please don't be a slacker -and "search the scriptures daily, whether these things be so" (Acts 17:10-13)

-=-Editor, Gordon W. Watts-=-
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